Stay Permit

(See this for context)

I was seen almost immediately at the place where foreigners get their stay permits, and the woman answered questions without an attitude and was able to give useful information. Germany: 1, Italy: 0.

Permesso di Soggiorno Epilogue

I recently found out about a service called Sportello Unico, which is an office that helps people with immigration issues, such as permessi di soggiorno. I don't know why I didn't find out about this two years ago. It's part of the government, so, at least in theory, they have official information. They even respond to questions via email. Here's the website. Below is some other useful information.



You're welcome.

Renewing the Permesso di Soggiorno, Parts 4-6

(Continued from here.)

I went to the questura on my designated appointment day. I waited about 3 hours, and then I was told I had to come in the afternoon. Apparently the appointment times have some meaning: you're either in the morning or in the afternoon.

So I returned that day in the afternoon, waited maybe 2 hours, and was told the permesso wasn't ready yet, and I should come back in 7-15 days (depending who I asked). The procedure in the afternoon, by the way, is slightly different than the morning. You have to stand in line outside the questura, then they take your letter with your appointment time on it and you move in to the entrance area (holding pen), where you stand and wait for them to call your name. When they call your name, you receive your number. So, instead of getting a number that only gets you another number, you just wait in line longer for the real number.

On the questura's website, you can check to see if your permesso is ready or not, and the website confirmed that mine wasn't ready on my appointment day, but I didn't know what would happen if I missed my appointment day (probably nothing, but you never know). Notice they didn't mention the website to those of us whose permessi weren't ready.

Anyway, according to that website, my permesso was ready about a week later, so I went back a day or so after that. I got there after the main rush, so there wasn't much of a line anymore. I only had to wait 20-30 minutes to find out that I had to show up between 12 and 2.

So today I went back around noon, waited in line outside, waited in the holding pen, then waited in the main area for a total of about 4 hours. Luckily I was in line between two other American women, so talking to them passed to time more pleasantly. Then I finally received my permesso di soggiorno. I NEVER HAVE TO GO BACK TO THE QUESTURA!

Renewing the Permesso di Soggiorno, Part 3

(This is a continuation of Part 2.)

I tried again at the questura today, and I was right. It turns out that all they wanted to see was the stamped letter I got when I received my visa last year...the letter they saw last year when I applied for my first permesso di soggiorno. I've found that there is no rational explanation for a lot of things in Italy, so it's better to just not think about it (I split that infinitive good). They definitely did not say anything indicating last year's letter, or the original enrollment letter, when I was at the questura a week ago.

My next "appointment" is in about a month, so it seems they did greatly reduce the length of this process (from a year to two months, barring unforeseen complications), though it's no more enjoyable.

Renewing the Permesso di Soggiorno, Part 2

I went to the questura today, and after waiting only 3 hours, was informed that the letter of enrollment from my school needed to be stamped by the Italian embassy/consulate in the US. I think it would be nice if that information were written down somewhere, like in the list of documents you need in order to renew your permesso di soggiorno. Either that, or someone (consulate, questura, the Italian government that wrote the list) doesn't know what they're talking about.

(This is a continuation of these three posts.)

Renewing the Permesso di Soggiorno

The following is a continuation of these two posts.

Last week I went to the Patronato, an Italian government organization that is supposed to be able to answer people's questions about permessi di soggiorno. When I got there, I told the man at the entrance that I had some questions, and he told me to go to the 5th floor and talk to "Flo" (not her real name). When I got to Flo's office, she asked if I had an appointment. I said no, and she told me to wait. I waited for about 40 mins -- I had learned by this time to bring a book in anticipation of things like this -- until some other people, presumably with an appointment, came in. Then Flo said that maybe I should make an appointment, to which I agreed. She said to come back at 11 on Monday. So I went back at 11 on Monday, and the same man at the entrance said Flo wasn't there, and that she was supposed to be in around 1. So I went back at 1, and several people who were leaving for lunch said the office closed at 1. The entrance man said I should go wait on the 5th floor for Flo. When I got there, the man with whom Flo shares an office thought it would be better if I made a new appointment, so I left my name and number, and he said she would call me that afternoon. Then I decided to try the post office. The woman there was able to answer all my questions. Not surprisingly, Flo did not call me that afternoon.

Today I applied to renew my permesso di soggiorno. Under a new system, the post office gives you your first questura appointment date when you give them your application package, instead of having to wait for the questura to mail you a letter. So far it appears they have shaved eight months off the process. If the second questura appointment date isn't significantly longer than three months after the first, this will be a pretty big improvement.

I should also note that the woman at the post office, and definitely not the man who was doing her job in the morning shift, was one of the nicest people I've encountered at an Italian government organization or store (assuming she wasn't giving me bad information). The only other person I can think of who deserves credit is the guy at the Intesa Sanpaolo bank on via della villa Demidoff, who spent a long time trying to help me, and then I didn't end up getting an account there because accounts for foreigners were way too expensive.

You won't believe it

... but my permesso di soggiorno, the one I received today, expires today. That's right, it's not a mistake. I asked. They said I have to apply for a new one now.

I was assured that the new system, which apparently was put in place since I applied for mine last year, is much faster. (haha)

(This is a continuation of the post about my first visit to the questura.)

Visa, Round 2

After mailing my visa application and a bunch of other required documents to the Italian Consulate in Philadelphia, waiting for 23 days (last year they had it to me in a week), and leaving messages and emailing the consulate and receiving no response, I drove to Philadelphia the night before my flight to try to get the visa from them in person. When I signed in, the employee behind the window said she recognized me and that my application was still being processed. I explained that my flight was scheduled for later that day, and I was hoping to get my visa now. After waiting about 1.5 hours, the woman called me over and said that I didn't need a visa, because I'll be getting a permesso di soggiorno. You'd think it would have been pretty easy to tell me that three weeks earlier. I also think it would be helpful if something to that effect appeared in a logical place, like on their website, or in their directions for applying for a visa, or in the directions for applying for a permesso di soggiorno, or in the book we have about living and studying in Italy, or on the Italian embassy website (perhaps on the "do I need a visa?" page), or on the Italian immigration website.

We'll see what the questura says.

On an unrelated note, I swear the sun is hotter here.

The Dread Permesso di Soggiorno

I'll add my permesso di soggiorno story (as it is so far) to the stockpile.

You need this to stay in Italy longer than eight days. That's a joke, though, because it takes about a year to actually get. First you obtain a packet from the post office -- one of the post offices that knows what you're talking about -- and then you send the application and various other materials to Rome and pay about 90 euros to do so. Then you receive a letter telling you when, 6 months from now, you are to report to the questura (police station) for fingerprinting. You go to the questura as early in the morning as possible, because the appointment time listed on your letter is meaningless. When I went, I was about the 230th person to arrive that day...at 7:50am (the employees start working around 8:15). I waited for about 2 hours, and, when my number was called, I received another number (the real number). Then I waited another 6 hours, during which time they closed for lunch for an hour. Then, when my number was called again, for a reason no one can explain, I was given another number. About an hour later, I was told that I would have to return the following morning, but that I could go directly to a certain window without a number (like they were doing me a favor by making me wait all day and then interfering with my life further by making me come back the next day). So I returned, waited for about an hour, and the guy who appeared at the window asked me why they hadn't dealt with me the previous day. The Italians I've dealt with always assume it's your fault. It took less than 10 minutes once he started helping me, and then he gave me a letter that he didn't sign containing a date to return, three months later, to receive the actual permesso di soggiorno. I'm not optimistic about the upcoming experience. I should also mention that they processed about 2 people an hour in the morning, and about 6 in the afternoon, with fewer employees.